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That's exactly what we're saying. Allah doesn't know sh t about the way the Universe works.
How can night and day swim in orbit?
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shit wrote:
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LOL !!!! So the Quran wants to clearly tell us that day and night orbit around the sun, but doesn't want to clearly tell us the earth does.
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shit wrote:
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You are 100% brainwashed.
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AhmedBahgat wrote:
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*Edit*, it seems that 21:33 is a scientific miracle, because it is indirectly telling us about the folloing:
1) the moon orbits the earth
2) the sun orbits the galaxy
3) the earth orbits the sun
I love the Quran :*)
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shit wrote:
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You mean, you love the fairy tales you make up about the Quran.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Hi Ahmed, thanks for your reply.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Well, I call it a 'rounded course' (or curved) because I believe that according to the Quran it has a beginning an end, a highest point and is not a complete circle. Hence it it cannot be an orbit.
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1400 ago it was visible as if the sun moves around the stationary earth, and now we know it by science
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Yes and that is exactly what the Quran is describing. Hence it cannot be the galactic year.
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1400 years ago, it looked repeated
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Yes and that is exactly why we know the Quran could not be talking about the galactic year.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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The Quran is telling the people to use the suns orbit (its stages) as such: hence the orbit the Quran is talking about cannot be the galactic year.
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Quote:
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Phedippedes wrote:
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d. has a starting point and an end (and a highest point).
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again, why is that?
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Because that's what you seem to see when you are living somewhere in the dessert in the 6th cenury.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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The galactic year is the orbit the sun is in around the centre of our Galaxy.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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The Galactic year is not used for timekeeping by Muslims (or anybody else for that matter) and the course the sun is in according to the Quran must be used exactly for that.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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The only rounded course Quran could be talking about is the one that we seem to see everyday: going from east, upwards to the suns zenith, and than downwards to the west.
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No, 21:33 is talking about 4 orbits, one for the sun, one for the moon, and one the day and one for the night
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Phedippedes wrote:
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quot;] Yes, and the one the sun is in is the one I described. Hence the Quran is geocentric.
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now the quran never detailed orbits really, it only said in less than 20 words that both those 4 entities move in an orbit each and logically speaking this is 100% true
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Phedippedes wrote:
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No it says a lot more, especially about the sun's course (see my previous points). These details taken together prove that the Quran is geocentric.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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This is the only rounded course that fits all Quranic criteria.
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Sorry Pheds that was total non sense
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Sorry, but that's simply not even an argument. I'm sure you can do better than that.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Not from any orbit (not the sun's orbit nor the earths orbit); night and day are caused by spin not by any orbit or any rounded course.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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The day and night don't move and they certainly have no mass. In order for something to be in an orbit it needs to have a mass.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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This is elementary physics.
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Quote:
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I'm not discussing elementary physics
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Yes you are, you are making claims about orbits. Orbits are part of Newtonian physics.
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Phedippedes wrote:
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The Quran describes the wrong orbit.
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3) The night moves in an orbit
4) The day moves in an orbit
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Phedippedes wrote:
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They don't. So those are wrong too.
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it is only this question, are any of the above 4 claims 100% wrong?
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Here Allah says it again: the course of the sun and the moon are something that you should see. ('Seest thou not..')
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Yassine wrote:
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Yep does it say the courses are signs?
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Phedippedes wrote:
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Yes it does and it also tells us that the movement of the sun and the moon along their 'falak' is visible.
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Hello All
I wanted to make this comment for a few days to expose the clear ignorance by many kafirs who know nothing about the Arabic language.
After reading Pheds pre last comment, it is evident that this kind of ignorance runs in their blood, I????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢m not looking to cure them rather to expose their sickness to the public, that????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢s all
The ignorant think when we use those Arabic words ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????أَلَمْ تَرَ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Alam Tara????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, i.e. ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see?????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, it has to mean literal seeing by the human eyes, LOL, what a bunch of ignornat
Of course their flawed understanding is not true, they are only ignorant with the language, in fact we can use the same words to present any of the following arguments:
1) Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see by eyes? (literal)
2) Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see by heart? (belief) (not literal)
3) Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see by mind? (logical) (not literal)
Many confused kafirs and Muslims accuse me of manipulating the Arabic words to suit my low desires, well, it seems this is the only thing they can come up with to refute my very strong Quran arguments that I worked hard on it, this is because I don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t invent, I only use the Quran to explain the Quran, therefore, let????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢s see how the Quran proves what I just said about the Arabic words : ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????أَلَمْ تَرَ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Alam Tara????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, i.e. ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? or ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Have you not seen????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????:
Have you not seen how your Lord dealt with the possessors of the elephant?
[The Quran ; 105:1]
أَلَمْ تَرَ كَيْفَ فَعَلَ رَبُّكَ بِأَصْحَابِ الْفِيلِ (1)
-> See the words ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????أَلَمْ تَرَ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Alam Tara????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, i.e. ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? or ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Have you not seen????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, Allah is asking Mohammed or any believer for that matter :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Have you not seen how your Lord dealt with the possessors of the elephant?????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, of course Mohammed didn????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t see that with his eyes because he was born in th same year (the year of the elephant), and of course non of us (now seen it with out own eyes), there for the words ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Alam Tara????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? means ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see (by belief) not by eyes????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, i.e. not literal
Yassine : 1
Pheds : 0
Have you not seen how your Lord dealt with Ad,
[The Quran ; 89:6]
أَلَمْ تَرَ كَيْفَ فَعَلَ رَبُّكَ بِعَادٍ (6)
-> Same as before, the prophet nor any of the believers have seen with the eyes how Allah dealt with Ad people, yet Allah is telling the believers: ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Have you not seen how your Lord dealt with Ad????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, of course Mohammed didn????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t see that with his eyes because he was born years after that incident, and of course non of us (now, seen it with our own eyes), i.e. the words ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Alam Tara????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? mean ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see (by belief) not by eyes????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, i.e. not literal
Yassine : 2
Pheds : 0
Do you not see how Allah has created the seven heavens ,~ one above another,
[The Quran ; 71:15]
أَلَمْ تَرَوْا كَيْفَ خَلَقَ اللَّهُ سَبْعَ سَمَاوَاتٍ طِبَاقًا (15)
-> In the above verse the words ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Alam Taraw????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? should mean ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Don????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t you see (by belief) not by eyes????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, because of course we can not see the other six heavens on top of the lowest heaven, and the verse clearly tell us that the 7 heavens are ON TOP OF EACH OTHER ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????Tibaqa????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, therefore this message :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Do you not see how Allah has created the seven heavens ,~ one above another,????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, has to be SEEING BY HEART, this is because the believers should have believed Allah when He said the following:
Do you not see that Allah created the heavens and the earth with truth? If He please He will take you off and bring a new creation,
[The Quran ; 14:19]
أَلَمْ تَرَ أَنَّ اللّهَ خَلَقَ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالأَرْضَ بِالْحقِّ إِن يَشَأْ يُذْهِبْكُمْ وَيَأْتِ بِخَلْقٍ جَدِيدٍ (19)
-> In 14:19, we can clearly see the same words used with seeing the creation of the heaven and earth with truth, and of course NO HUMAN HAVE SEEN THAT, i.e. this message :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Do you not see that Allah created the heavens and the earth with truth?????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, has to be non literal, i.e. SEEING BY HEART, this is because we believe Allah when He said He created the heaven with truth, i.e. for a believer the other six heavens exist 100%, the believer can only see one (the lowest one), the others are there because they see THEM BY HEART, aren????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t they believers?
The problem is when a bunch of ignorant kafirs stick their nose in what does not belong the them, the whole guidance in the Quran message does not belong to them, only the warnings it is what they should look at
Again, no human saw how Allah created the heavens and earth with truth, i.e. the words ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????Alam Tara????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, in 14:19 has to SEEING BY THE HEART, i.e. non literal
Yassine: 3
Pheds:0
7: Do you not see that Allah knows whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth? Nowhere is there a secret counsel between three persons but He is the fourth of them, nor (between) five but He is the sixth of them, nor less than that nor more but He is with them wheresoever they are; then He will inform them of what they did on the day of resurrection: surely Allah is Cognizant of all things.
[The Quran ; 58:7]
أَلَمْ تَرَ أَنَّ اللَّهَ يَعْلَمُ مَا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ مَا يَكُونُ مِن نَّجْوَى ثَلَاثَةٍ إِلَّا هُوَ رَابِعُهُمْ وَلَا خَمْسَةٍ إِلَّا هُوَ سَادِسُهُمْ وَلَا أَدْنَى مِن ذَلِكَ وَلَا أَكْثَرَ إِلَّا هُوَ مَعَهُمْ أَيْنَ مَا كَانُوا ثُمَّ يُنَبِّئُهُم بِمَا عَمِلُوا يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ بِكُلِّ شَيْءٍ عَلِيمٌ (7)
-> In verse 58:7, of course we can not see by the eyes that Allah ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? knows whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, therefore the question :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Do you not see that Allah knows whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth?????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, is SEEING BY LOGIC AND BELIEF, not by the eyes, this is because (logically speaking) a believer in Allah must SEE BY THE MIND the Allah knows whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth .
Yassine: 4
Pheds:0
Seest thou not those that dispute concerning the Signs of Allah? How are they turned away (from Reality)?-
[The Quran ; 40:69]
أَلَمْ تَرَ إِلَى الَّذِينَ يُجَادِلُونَ فِي آيَاتِ اللَّهِ أَنَّى يُصْرَفُونَ (69)
-> Here is a SEEING by mind (logical), 40:69 is telling us :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Have you not seen those who dispute with respect to the communications of Allah: how are they turned away?????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, now of course we can see ignorant like Pheds disputing the communications of Allah, however we did not see him by the eyes, or did we?, well I didn????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢t even know his face. However it is logical that Pheds is doing just that (disputing Allah message) and what the believers should SEE WITH THE MIND that in their silly disputes they turn away from reality
Yassine: 5
Pheds:0
Here is a good one:
Do you not see that Allah is He Whom do glorify all those who are in the heavens and the earth, and the (very) birds with expanded wings? He knows the prayer of each one and its glorification, and Allah is Cognizant of what they do.
[The Quran ; 24:41]
أَلَمْ تَرَ أَنَّ اللَّهَ يُسَبِّحُ لَهُ مَن فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالْأَرْضِ وَالطَّيْرُ صَافَّاتٍ كُلٌّ قَدْ عَلِمَ صَلَاتَهُ وَتَسْبِيحَهُ وَاللَّهُ عَلِيمٌ بِمَا يَفْعَلُونَ (41)
-> The verse above is telling us :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Do you not see that Allah is He Whom do glorify all those who are in the heavens and the earth????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, oh come one mister Pheds, can we see that?, see how your ignorance is exposed?, and I mean by see in my question to you is ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????SEEING BY MIND????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????
Yassine: 6
Pheds:0
Do you not see that We have sent the Shaitans against the unbelievers, inciting them by incitement?
[The Quran ; 19:83]
أَلَمْ تَرَ أَنَّا أَرْسَلْنَا الشَّيَاطِينَ عَلَى الْكَافِرِينَ تَؤُزُّهُمْ أَزًّا (83)
-> Now, I might ask mister Pheds who possibly posses a bionic Eye, : did you see Allah when He :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? sent the Shaitans against the unbelievers, inciting them by incitement?????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢, not really sure mister Pheds what type of bionic eye that will allow you to see Allah when He sends the Shaitans against the unbelievers, inciting them by incitement.
Yassine: 7
Pheds:0
Have you not seen the chiefs of the children of Israel after Musa, when they said to a prophet of theirs: Raise up for us a king, (that) we may fight in the way of Allah. He said: May it not be that you would not fight if fighting is ordained for you? They said: And what reason have we that we should not fight in the way of Allah, and we have indeed been compelled to abandon our homes and our children. But when fighting was ordained for them, they turned back, except a few of them, and Allah knows the unjust.
[The Quran ; 2:246]
أَلَمْ تَرَ إِلَى الْمَلإِ مِن بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ مِن بَعْدِ مُوسَى إِذْ قَالُواْ لِنَبِيٍّ لَّهُمُ ابْعَثْ لَنَا مَلِكًا نُّقَاتِلْ فِي سَبِيلِ اللّهِ قَالَ هَلْ عَسَيْتُمْ إِن كُتِبَ عَلَيْكُمُ الْقِتَالُ أَلاَّ تُقَاتِلُواْ قَالُواْ وَمَا لَنَا أَلاَّ نُقَاتِلَ فِي سَبِيلِ اللّهِ وَقَدْ أُخْرِجْنَا مِن دِيَارِنَا وَأَبْنَآئِنَا فَلَمَّا كُتِبَ عَلَيْهِمُ الْقِتَالُ تَوَلَّوْاْ إِلاَّ قَلِيلاً مِّنْهُمْ وَاللّهُ عَلِيمٌ بِالظَّالِمِينَ (246)
-> See mister Pheds, the prophet, you, Yassine, and myself, lives thusands of years after Moses, however the verse above is asking the believer: ????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Have you not seen the chiefs of the children of Israel after Musa, when they said to a prophet of theirs: Raise up for us a king, (that) we may fight in the way of Allah????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, but possibly you managed to see that using your Bionic Eye,
Yassine: 8
Pheds:0
Have you not seen him who disputed with Ibrahim about his Lord, because Allah had given him the kingdom? When Ibrahim said: My Lord is He who gives life and causes to die, he said: I give life and cause death. Ibrahim said: So surely Allah causes the sun to rise from the east, then make it rise from the west; thus he who disbelieved was confounded; and Allah does not guide aright the unjust people.
[The Quran ; 2:258]
أَلَمْ تَرَ إِلَى الَّذِي حَآجَّ إِبْرَاهِيمَ فِي رِبِّهِ أَنْ آتَاهُ اللّهُ الْمُلْكَ إِذْ قَالَ إِبْرَاهِيمُ رَبِّيَ الَّذِي يُحْيِي وَيُمِيتُ قَالَ أَنَا أُحْيِي وَأُمِيتُ قَالَ إِبْرَاهِيمُ فَإِنَّ اللّهَ يَأْتِي بِالشَّمْسِ مِنَ الْمَشْرِقِ فَأْتِ بِهَا مِنَ الْمَغْرِبِ فَبُهِتَ الَّذِي كَفَرَ وَاللّهُ لاَ يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الظَّالِمِينَ (258)
-> Same as the previous verse nor Mohammad or any believer for that matter saw Ibrahim, therefore the question :????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬???????????????????????????? Have you not seen him who disputed with Ibrahim about his Lord, because Allah had given him the kingdom?????????????????????????????¢?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¬????????????????????????????, has to be seeing by heart, i.e. non literal
Yassine: 9
Pheds:0
From all the above we can conclude the following:
1) Mister Pheds is a clear cut ignorant regarding the Quran and the Arabic language
2) Yassine has knocked out Pheds silly argument regarding seeing by the eyes and the Quran confirmed Yassine simple argument
3)The GAME is OVER for Pheds
Salam
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