- Wed 26 Dec, 2007 2:04 am
Post subject: Apple_Pie Series NO. 2
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Apple Pie
Guest Group Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 138 Posted: 27 May 2006 at 6:44pm | IP Logged All, How is it that Jesus is proclaimed as the Son, in the Muslim book of faith...? Ya ahla alkitabi la taghloo fee deenikum wala taqooloo AAala Allahi illa alhaqqa innama almaseehu AAeesa ibnu maryama rasoolu Allahi wakalimatuhu alqaha ila maryama waroohun minhu faaminoo biAllahi warusulihi wala taqooloo thalathatun intahoo khayran lakum innama Allahu ilahun wahidun subhanahu an yakoona lahu waladun lahu ma fee alssamawati wama fee al-ardi wakafa biAllahi wakeelan 4.171 You The Book's family, certainly do not go beyond the limits in your faith, and certainly they say against ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? except the truth, only the Messiah Jesus, Mary's son, a message; ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? and his Word cast forth to her Mary, and Spirit from him; so believe on account of ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢??????????????????????, and his messengers, and certainly they say: "Three." Refrain (it is) agreeable; certainly your only ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢??????????????????????, one god glory be to him, that He has certainly been his child, truly his; what not in the heavens and not in the earth and He sufficed on account of ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢??????????????????????, a witness. The Biblical truth is right here in one ayah... ?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢ Father ?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢ Son ?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢ Spirit Pretty amazing... |
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Apple Pie
Guest Group Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 138 Posted: 27 May 2006 at 7:43pm | IP Logged Greetings, Don?????????????????????¢??t forget to mention these renderings?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦ "Progressive Muslims" O people of the Scripture, do not overstep in your system, nor say about God except the truth. Jesus the son of Mary was no more than God's messenger and His word which He delivered to Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in God and His messengers, and do not say: "Three." Cease, for it is better for you. God is only One god, be He glorified that He should have a son! To Him is all that is in the heavens and what is in the earth. God is enough as a caretaker. (4.171) "Literal Koran, Mohamed Ahmed" You The Book's people, do not exaggerate/exceed the limit in your religion, and do not say on (about) God except the truth , but the Messiah, Jesus, Mary's son (is) God's messenger and His word/expression He threw it away to Mary, and a Soul/Spirit from Him; so believe with God, and His messengers, and do not say: "Three." Stop (it is) best for you, but God (is) one God, His praise/glory that to be for him a child; for Him what (is) in the skies/space and what (is) in the earth/Planet Earth, enough/sufficient with God (as a) guardian/protector. (4.171) As you can see for yourself, these two translators were able to accurately understand that 4.171 is proclaiming that Jesus is the Son. There can be no doubt?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦ |
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Apple Pie
Guest Group Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 138 Posted: 27 May 2006 at 10:41pm | IP Logged We are discussing what the Koran states...not what islam states... Do you follow the Koran...or Islam...? As you can verify for yourself, the Arabic of 4.171 clearly and irrefutably states that Jesus is the Son. |
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Apple Pie
Guest Group Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 138 Posted: 27 May 2006 at 11:07pm | IP Logged "A poster wrote: Apple Pie: The Arabic in the Quran for this Ayat does not translate to what you have written above. Arabic is not my first language, so I got my husband, who is an Arab, to read and translate directly from the Quran. I did not tell him why or what I was looking for, just asked for an exact translation. I must state here that my husband has a degree in languages, speaking Arabic, French, and English. The Quran clearly states, in Arabic that God is One and He has no son. Once again, I don't know where you are getting this translation from, but it is not correct." Apple_Pie responded: "Let?????????????????????¢??s take a closer look at the Arabic Ya ahla alkitabi la taghloo fee deenikum wala taqooloo AAala Allahi illa alhaqqa innama almaseehu AAeesa ibnu maryama rasoolu Allahi wakalimatuhu alqaha ila maryama waroohun minhu faaminoo biAllahi warusulihi wala taqooloo thalathatun intahoo khayran lakum innama Allahu ilahun wahidun subhanahu an yakoona lahu waladun lahu ma fee alssamawati wama fee al-ardi wakafa biAllahi wakeelan The singular, masculine pronoun ?????????????????????¢??hu?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? is juxtaposed on each side of ?????????????????????¢??waladun?????????????????????¢??????????????????????. There can be absolutely no doubt that it refers to your ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? being in possession of a son?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦ Observe?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦ ?????????????????????¢??hu?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? definition: An indeclinable affixed personal or possessive pronoun of third person singular masculine; when affixed to a verb or preposition as a person pronoun, it means him or it; and when to a noun as a possessive, his or it. Singular personal or possessive pronoun. Him. Verbal suffix which expresses the accusative. References: A Grammar of the Arabic Language, W. Wright, Third edition, volume 1, p. 100 A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran, John Penrice, p. 152 ?????????????????????¢??la?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? + ?????????????????????¢??hu?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? = ?????????????????????¢??lahu?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? = certainly him Further?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦.look at the context of 4.171?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦as it describes the Son Jesus as having the attributes of God Almighty?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦ ?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢ 4.172?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦goes on to describe that that Jesus will gather them to Himself?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦.as described in the holy Bible?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦only God has this power?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦ ?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢ 4.173?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦informs us that to Jesus they believed and did the righteous deeds. Jesus pays in full their rewards ?????????????????????¢?? from His Grace. He torments the unbelievers. ?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦.as described in the holy Bible?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦only God has this power?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦ ?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¢ 4.174...Jesus came as convincing proof from the Lord, as a clear and evident Light?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦as described in the Holy Bible?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦.only God has this power?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦Jesus is the Light... This is an open & shut case. Jesus is not only the Son, but Jesus is God Almighty. Right from your book of faith?????????????????????¢??????????????????????¦..as copied straight from the Holy Bible by the authors who penned the text. Thanks |
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Apple Pie: Hal taltakallum Arabi? Kifhalluk. Masalkhair. Mahuwa ismuka al khakiki? Maladi ana khitabtu? |
There was no response.
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BMZ
Moderator Group Joined: 03 April 2006 Location: Singapore Online Status: Offline Posts: 1548 Posted: 27 May 2006 at 11:30pm | IP Logged I live in Singapore and we use a local chilli from Malaysia. This chilli is very tiny but extremely hot. It is called Chilli Padi in Malay language. and here it is for adding to Apple Pie's pudding : "Ya ahla alkitabi la taghloo fee deenikum wala taqooloo AAala Allahi illa alhaqqa innama almaseehu AAeesa ibnu maryama rasoolu Allahi wakalimatuhu alqaha ila maryama waroohun minhu faaminoo biAllahi warusulihi wala taqooloo thalathatun intahoo khayran lakum innama Allahu ilahun wahidun subhanahu an yakoona lahu waladun lahu ma fee alssamawati wama fee al-ardi wakafa biAllahi wakeelan First, Apple Pie quotes in the translation starting with "You The Book's family. That refers to the People of the Book or simply "Oh, Followers of the Books" and this refers only to Jews and Christians. They are told not to mess up or mix things in the religion, which is the real meaning of "la taghloo fee deenikum" and it also means "Don't talk nonsense or don't transgress by saying or making wrong statements about God's religion". I am sure your husband will enjoy this, being an Arab while I am a non-Arab. The translation quoted by Apple Pie (I don't know which translation Apple Pie is referring to) as the translation seems to have been messed deliberately and Apple Pie has already "Taghlooed" or "Taghlooded". : 4.171 You The Book's family, certainly do not go beyond the limits in your faith, and certainly they say against ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? except the truth, only the Messiah Jesus, Mary's son, a message; ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢?????????????????????? and his Word cast forth to her Mary, and Spirit from him; so believe on account of ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢??????????????????????, and his messengers, and certainly they say: "Three." Refrain (it is) agreeable; certainly your only ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢??????????????????????, one god glory be to him, that He has certainly been his child, truly his; what not in the heavens and not in the earth and He sufficed on account of ?????????????????????¢??allah?????????????????????¢??????????????????????, a witness. His word does not mean Jesus in the verse. The spirit or Spirit also does not mean Jesus. It simply means to explain that God said,"Let there be a child for Mary and Jesus was conceived." Then God said,"Let life be given to the foetus in Mary's womb" and Jesus got his soul or his ghost or his spirit." Thus Glory be to God only. The Word or His Word in Arabic simply means God's Command like "Let there be day, there was day". This was "His Word". God said,"Let ther be night, there was night" This was also "His Word". Then God said, "Let the Earth produce vegetation." This was another of "His Word." Thus, Adam was His Word, Eve was His word, even Iblis/Satan was also His Word. There are millions of "His Words", and this has nothing to do with the "Word of John". My Word! I had to do this chilli padi dish fast before rushing out. BMZ |